
云安全花了十年时间学会看见一切。它发现的一半问题仍然处于开放状态。Tamnoon 首席执行官表示,接下来的十年属于那些懂得何时不该行动的机器,而从今天起,她正在公布她的机器所拒绝的内容。玛丽娜·塞格尔帮助打造了能够看见一切的机器。
Cloud security spent a decade learning to see everything. Half of what it found is still open. Tamnoon’s CEO says the next decade belongs to machines that know when not to act, and as of today she is publishing what hers refused. Marina Segal helped build the machines that see everything.
她曾在 Dome9 Security 工作,当时该公司定义了云安全态势管理;随后在 Check Point 工作,后者收购了该公司。这一理念彻底获胜。如今,一个配置错误的存储桶、一个开放的端口或一个权限过大的角色,在被创建后几分钟内就会在任何云平台上的十几款扫描器之一的控制台中显现出来。检测工作已经完成。没有人会严肃地对此提出异议。然后她观察了这些发现的后续情况。
She was at Dome9 Security when it defined cloud security posture management, and at Check Point after it bought the company. The idea won completely. Today a misconfigured bucket, an open port or an over-permissioned role shows up in a console within minutes of being created, in any cloud, on any of a dozen scanners. Detection is finished. Nobody serious argues otherwise. Then she watched what happened to the findings.
“完全没有发生什么,”她说。“它们什么都没发生。我们建立了一个能够看到云中每一个问题的行业,然后我们把这些问题归档了。”她自己公司的数据给出了一个具体数字:云端曾被检测到的所有问题中,超过一半仍然处于开放状态。一个关键问题平均需要 150 天才能得到修复,而且这一数字还在变糟,而不是变好。根据 CrowdStrike 的统计,攻击者从初始立足点到横向移动仅需 29 分钟。而在警报触发后,防御方的“时钟”则以月份为单位运行。
“Nothing,” she says. “Nothing happened to them. We built an industry that could see every problem in the cloud, and then we filed the problems.”Her company’s own data puts a figure on the filing cabinet. More than half of everything ever detected in the cloud is still open. A critical finding now takes 150 days on average to heal, and the number is getting worse, not better. By CrowdStrike’s count, an attacker moves from first foothold to lateral movement in 29 minutes. The defender’s clock, once the alert has fired, runs in months.
塞格尔于 2021 年共同创立了 Tamnoon,以弥合这一差距。她所打造的东西比一个更快的按钮更为奇特。她打造了一台以“拒绝”为最自豪输出的机器。
Segal co-founded Tamnoon in 2021 to close that gap. What she built is stranger than a faster button. She built a machine whose proudest output is a refusal.
行业一直在自动化“是” 作为对修复积压的应对,行业的答案一直是自动化,而在过去十八个月里,这种趋势以强势之势到来。如今,几乎每个云安全平台都随带一个代理,该代理主动提出要自行完成修改。这些发布公告承诺的内容如出一辙:速度、一个审批步骤、回滚能力以及控制权。然而,这些开关中的大多数仍然处于关闭状态。
Everyone automated the yes The industry’s answer to a remediation backlog was always going to be automation, and in the last eighteen months it arrived in force. Nearly every cloud security platform now ships an agent that offers to make the change itself. The launch posts promise the same things: speed, an approval step, a rollback, control. Most of those switches stay off. Ask a cloud security team why, and the answer has nothing to do with the technology.
询问云安全团队原因时,答案与技术无关。它与变更的责任人有关。在生产环境中,每一次变更都由某人负责,而没有人会批准机器无法解释的变更。错误的修复措施看起来并不像安全故障,而像是一次中断,附带一张注明谁批准了该变更的工单。
It has to do with the name on the change. In production, every change is somebody’s responsibility, and nobody approves a change a machine cannot explain. A wrong remediation does not look like a security failure. It looks like an outage, with a ticket that says who approved it.
“这个市场上的每个供应商都在卖速度,”塞加尔说。“速度从来不是问题。从来没有人担心修复会很慢。他们担心的是修复会出错,而他们会成为那个说‘是的’的人。”她认为这种担忧是正确的。这不是培训问题,不是变更管理问题,也不是文化问题。这是对自动化的理性回应——这种自动化从未向买家展示过它会拒绝做什么。
“Every vendor in this market is selling speed,” Segal says. “Speed was never the problem. Nobody was ever afraid the fix would be slow. They were afraid it would be wrong, and that they would be the one who said yes to it.”She thinks the fear is correct. Not a training problem, not a change-management problem, not a culture problem. A rational response to automation that has never once shown a buyer what it would refuse to do.
“一个不能说‘不’的机器不是自动化,”她说。“它只是带有API的负债。”我们首先实现自动化的是克制。Tamnoon在此与其他同类产品分道扬镳,而且是从根本上分开的。
“A machine that cannot say no is not automation,” she says. “It’s a liability with an API.”The first thing we automated was restraint Here is where Tamnoon parts from the rest of the category, and it parts at the root.
所有修复产品都是为了执行而构建的。Tamnoon的引擎是为了决策而构建的,而它学到的第一个决策就是“不”。在被允许对客户的云环境做出任何更改之前,它被教导去阅读:哪些内容依赖于此资源,谁拥有它,最近有什么变化,流量情况如何。然后它被教导去拒绝它无法证明安全的变更,并说明原因。
Every remediation product is built to act. Tamnoon’s engine was built to decide, and the first decision it learned was no. Before it was allowed to change anything in a customer’s cloud, it was taught to read: what depends on this resource, who owns it, what changed recently, what the traffic says. Then it was taught to refuse the change it could not prove safe, and to say why.
“机器在学会何时停止之前很久就学会了如何行动,”塞格尔说。“我们教它的顺序恰好相反。我们首先自动化的东西是克制。这种顺序就是整个公司。”塔姆努恩演示的内容在一分钟内就说明了这一点。六个存储桶,面向互联网开放,在扫描器中完全相同。同样的警报,同样的严重程度,同样的红色。引擎读取了全部六个。
“A machine learns to act long before it learns when to stop,” Segal says. “We taught ours in the other order. The first thing we automated was restraint. That order is the whole company.”The demo Tamnoon runs makes the point in under a minute. Six storage buckets, open to the internet, identical in the scanner. Same alert, same severity, same red. The engine reads all six.
其中三个可以安全关闭,于是它通过客户自身的变更流程关闭了它们,并准备好回滚。它以书面形式拒绝了另外两个,因为该变更会切断某些扫描器无法看到的在线内容。还有一个既没有关闭也没有拒绝。它提出了询问,因为所有者未知,且它不会猜测。
Three are safe to close, and it closes them, through the customer’s own change process, with a rollback ready. Two it declines, in writing, because the change would have severed something live that the scanner could not see. One it neither closes nor declines. It asks, because the owner is unknown and it will not guess.
一个警报。三个正确答案。扫描器每次都正确。扫描器从来不是问题。
One alert. Three correct answers. The scanner was right every time. The scanner was never the problem.
使拒绝变得有用而非令人烦躁的是随之而来的内容。引擎的拒绝附带了发现内容、最初读取的内容、裁决、原因、以及唯一能够改变裁决的事实,还有手动执行的步骤。“没有证据的拒绝只是耸耸肩,”塞格尔说。“有证据的拒绝是你可以在早上九点捍卫的决定。被拒绝就是一种答案。”自主权不是被授予的。它是赢得的。
What makes the refusal useful rather than annoying is what comes with it. A decline from the engine carries the finding, what was read first, the verdict, the reason, the one fact that would change the verdict, and the steps to do it by hand. “A refusal without evidence is a shrug,” Segal says. “A refusal with the evidence is a decision you can defend at nine in the morning. Declined is an answer.”Autonomy isn’t granted. It’s earned.
与该类别的第二个断裂涉及信任,并且它颠覆了行业二十年来销售自动化的方式。
The second break with the category is about trust, and it inverts how the industry has sold automation for twenty years.
惯例是一个旋钮。供应商提供该能力,客户选择打开多少,而选择的风险由客户承担。塔姆努恩的引擎从旋钮设为零开始。它仅建立只读连接,不对客户的云进行任何更改。只有在其在某类发现上的记录成立后,才会被授予对该类发现采取行动的权利,而客户始终保留否决权。
The convention is a dial. The vendor ships the capability, the customer chooses how much of it to switch on, and the risk of the choice belongs to the customer. Tamnoon’s engine starts with the dial at zero. It connects read-only and changes nothing in the customer’s cloud. It is granted the right to act on a class of finding only after its record on that class holds, and the customer keeps the veto throughout.
“保留否决权,”塞格尔说。“它赢得了钥匙。它也可能失去钥匙。自治不是你购买的功能。它是一段记录,而记录是可以被阅读的。” 该记录的单位是收据。引擎所作的每一个决定——无论是关闭还是拒绝——都会变成一份收据:包含六个字段,审计员无需翻译即可读取。当客户的工程师覆盖引擎时,该覆盖也会被记录下来,并成为引擎下次判断该环境的依据。它通过整个机队变得更智能,并对每个客户的云更加严格。
“You keep the veto,” Segal says. “It earns the keys. And it can lose them. Autonomy isn’t a feature you buy. It’s a track record, and a track record is something you can read.”The unit of that record is the receipt. Every decision the engine makes, closures and refusals alike, becomes one: six fields, readable by an auditor without a translator. When a customer’s engineer overrides the engine, the override goes into the record too, and becomes how the engine judges that environment next time. It gets smarter from the whole fleet and stricter about each customer’s cloud.
“董事会永远不会问你修复有多快,”塞格尔说。“他们会问你是如何知道它是安全的。我们构建了对第二个问题的答案。” 一个能够自我修复的云实际上是什么样子,塞格尔对此用词很谨慎,因为运维人员一听到这句话就会想到Pod重启。
“The board will never ask you how fast the fix was,” Segal says. “They will ask how you knew it was safe. We built the answer to the second question.”What a cloud that heals itself actually looks like Segal is careful with the phrase, because operations people hear it and think of pods restarting.
“你的云已经在自行重启了,”她说。“它从未自行关闭过自己的安全漏洞。修复意味着暴露已被消除,这是通过你自身的变更流程实现的,而且有人能够说明原因。” 她对未来五年的描述很具体。安全团队将不再成为他们未参与设计的变更的责任边界。积压工作将不再是一个档案柜,而是一个带有裁决的队列。工程师们将只看到一个问题,而以前他们会看到142个警报——这是Tamnoon交叉扫描模型平均产生的比例。
“Your cloud already restarts itself,” she says. “It has never once closed its own security hole. Healing means the exposure is gone, through your own change process, and someone can defend how.”Her picture of the next five years is specific. Security teams stop being the liability boundary for changes they did not design. The backlog stops being a filing cabinet and becomes a queue with verdicts in it. Engineers see one problem where they used to see 142 alerts, which is the ratio Tamnoon’s cross-scanner model produces on average.
同样的八种错误配置将不再每个季度反复出现,因为一旦修复就能保持修复状态。自治也不再是供应商设置中的一个勾选框,而是根据发现类别授予的,就像信用额度一样,以证据为依据。
The same eight misconfigurations stop coming back every quarter, because what heals once stays healed. And autonomy stops being a checkbox in a vendor’s settings and becomes something granted per class of finding, like a credit limit, on evidence.
她还提出了三个预测,并愿意在公开场合承认自己可能错了。拒绝将成为每个修复RFP中的一条条款。收据将取代评分,成为买家比较的依据。而且没有供应商会在不展示修复效果下降的情况下销售修复服务。
Three predictions come with it, and she is willing to be wrong about them in public. Refusal becomes a line in every remediation RFP. The receipt replaces the score as the thing buyers compare. And no vendor sells remediation without showing a decline.
“五年后,没有人会向无法向其展示其拒绝的内容的供应商购买修复服务,”她说。“这个问题听起来会显而易见。如今,没有人会提出这个问题。”已经使用该引擎一年的客户描述了比例的变化。一位客户的未处理发现从6,074个减少到四个季度后的2,041个,减少了三倍,到期末新警报减少了93%。一家医疗公司对单个发现的端到端定价为:人工处理需8,775美元,通过引擎处理仅需775美元。
“In five years nobody will buy remediation from a vendor who can’t show them what it refused,” she says. “The question will sound obvious. Today nobody asks it.”The customers who have run the engine for a full year describe the change in ratios. One went from 6,074 open findings to 2,041 over four quarters, three times fewer, with 93% fewer new alerts arriving by the end. One healthcare company priced a single finding end to end: $8,775 to close it by hand, $775 through the engine.
华纳音乐集团是该公司的命名客户。Tamnoon已筹集超过1800万美元,其A轮融资由Bright Pixel Capital领投,其引擎可读取十七个扫描器的发现,其中包括Wiz和CrowdStrike Falcon Cloud Security。
Warner Music Group is a named customer. Tamnoon has raised more than $18 million, with a Series A led by Bright Pixel Capital, and its engine reads findings from seventeen scanners, Wiz and CrowdStrike Falcon Cloud Security among them.
数字与记录 今日,Tamnoon发布了两项该市场通常不发布的内容。
The number, and the record Today Tamnoon publishes two things this market does not usually publish.
第一项是一个数字。云安全一直在公布攻击者移动的速度。但它一直很少公布其修复的速度。今日早上发布的《云修复指数》源自公司报告所依据的同一份1486万条检测数据,它在一个地方回答了两个问题:所有曾被检测到的内容中仍处于未处理状态的比例是多少?以及一个关键发现保持未处理状态的时长是多久?攻击者的时钟以分钟计量。而此指数以月份计量。
The first is a number. Cloud security has always published how fast attackers move. It has been much quieter about how slowly it heals. The Cloud Remediation Index, out this morning, comes from the same 14.86 million detections behind the company’s report, and it answers two questions in one place: what share of everything ever detected is still open, and how long a critical finding stays open. The attacker’s clock is measured in minutes. This one is measured in months.
第二项是一份记录。截至今日,Tamnoon维护一个公开页面,列出其引擎拒绝的修复事项,每项包含六个字段。
The second is a record. As of today, Tamnoon keeps a public page of the remediations its engine declined, each with the six fields.
“在这个行业里,每家公司都会公布其成功案例,”塞加尔说。“我们公布的是我们未做出的改变。这是一份奇怪的自豪清单,直到你问:在让机器进入生产环境之前,安全团队应该先阅读哪份清单。”与此同时,公司还公布了其认为买家应向任何修复供应商(包括自身)提出的六个问题。第一个问题是:它能否拒绝一个变更,并展示一份附带证据的拒绝记录。
“Every company in this industry publishes its wins,” Segal says. “We are publishing the changes we did not make. It is a strange list to be proud of, until you ask which of the two lists a security team should read before it lets a machine into production.”Alongside them, the company has published the six questions it says buyers should put to any remediation vendor, itself included. The first: can it refuse a change, and show one refusal with the evidence attached.
“每个人都在演示修复方案,”塞格尔说。“让他们演示衰退。”这是一种重新启动安全公司的不寻常方式,先讲产品不会做什么,再讲行业很少对外公布的一个数字。但传统方式已经用了十年,而它发现的一半问题仍然存在。塞格尔的赌注是,云安全的第二个十年属于那台已经赢得触碰生产环境权利的机器——一次一次地拒绝。公司对它的描述只有八个字。每个人都在自动化“是”。我们掌握了“否”。投稿文章。非TNW新闻室制作,也不代表TNW的编辑立场。
“Everyone demos the fix,” Segal says. “Ask them to demo the decline.”It is an unusual way to relaunch a security company, leading with what the product will not do and a number the industry rarely publishes about itself. But the conventional way has had a decade, and half of everything it found is still open. Segal’s bet is that the second decade of cloud security belongs to the machine that has earned the right to touch production, one refusal at a time. The company’s own words for it are eight. Everyone automates the yes. We mastered the no. Contributed article. Not produced by the TNW newsroom and does not reflect the editorial stance of TNW.