我们芝加哥现场录制节目的第三集、也是最后一集，嘉宾是芝加哥大学教授、2024年诺贝尔经济学奖得主詹姆斯·罗宾逊（他与达龙·阿西莫格鲁、西蒙·约翰逊共享该奖）。
The third and last episode from our Chicago live show is with James Robinson, a professor at the University of Chicago and a recipient of the 2024 Nobel Prize in economics (which he shared with Daron Acemoglu and Simon Johnson).
他最著名的著作是2012年的《国家为什么会失败》，他在书中与合著者阿西莫格鲁记录了决定一些国家繁荣、另一些国家不振的制度因素——无论是可靠举行的选举，还是有助于促进创新的开放市场。
His most famous work is 2012's Why Nations Fail, and in that book he and his co-author Acemoglu document the institutional factors — whether it is reliably run elections or open markets that help facilitate innovation — that determine why some states thrive and others don't.
因此我们向罗宾逊提出了一个大问题：美国要被视为失败的国家，需要发生什么？
So we ask Robinson the big question: What would have to happen for the US to be considered a failed state?